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Author Topic: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security  (Read 377 times)

mike822

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Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« on: December 02, 2017, 09:28:30 AM »
Guys - I live in a fairly safe neighborhood of NYC surrounded by some courthouses which has always kept level of crime here quite low. However, there have been some stories of house break-ins in the past both when people were in and out of their homes. So far, this is what I did to get peace of mind when nobody is home. I installed 10 motion sensors to cover the basement, 1st floor and 2nd floor bedrooms and also installed 3 contact sensors on the 3 main entry doors. When we go to sleep, I do arm stay but obviously none of the 25 windows in the basement & 1st floor are protected and there are no shock sensors either. Is there a clever way of safeguarding my home when we are upstairs sleeping without installing 30+ additional sensors. Are most thieves able to open windows to get in or typically just smash them

Secondly, I'm currently signed up with central station monitoring but typically NYPD treats these home alarm calls as very low priority and only show up few hours later. I'm thinking of installing indoor cameras so when I get an alarm, I can call NYPD directly if I indeed see an active intrusion and they said they treat that as very high priority. If that's the case, then maybe I can self-monitor completely. Does anybody know of a service that provides the total connect mobile app but no central station monitoring

Thx

securitydude123

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2017, 11:19:53 AM »
Hi Mike, sounds like your got a pretty super system in place already. When it comes to the basement and 1st floor windows, are they all in the same general area? could you cover this with a few glass break sensors? generally you can get 20Ft both ways witih a decent sized window for glass break. if you are not needing to go down to these areas during the night you could also set some of the downstairs zones as interior zones so they will arm in stay mode, so no matter how someone gets in, if they are walking around, they will get picked up.

As for a fully encompassing app for free, thats not going to happen. From my knowledge you cannot get a good platform app for these systems that tie cameras in for no monthly cost. you would need to use alarm.com or similar platform. These apps are to costly for the owners to run for free. If you want to monitor yourself though there are products out there to allow you to do so, there are some apps that allow you to get notification of your security systems activity and allow you to arm and disarm remotely, all you do is buy a module for the panel. What panel do you have so we can make app recommendations. as for cameras, you can just dowload a second app and view your cameras when you see you have an alarm. take an extra 5 seconds, and i actually recommend this to my customers. Platforms like Alarm.com have cameras built in but they are wireless and web based, this makes the picture quality poor and getting video clip a night mare. If you have a separate NVR system then its all very simple to control.

If you are hard wiring cameras i would recommend a FLIR 4 camera kit as this system is plug and play, simple install, great quality, and to hook into your app you only need to scan the QR code on the device, otherwise if you need wireless cameras I think unfortunately Lorex leads the pack.
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mike822

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2017, 03:27:15 PM »
I'm ok keeping cameras separate on an NVR. I have the honeywell L5210 - how can I get notifications on my phone and what module should I buy. Good idea on using internal zone for the basement motion detectors. How about the 1st floor where someone may come down at night for food/drink. Will putting glass break be sufficient or can intruders silently open my double hung windows and I won't even know someone is downstairs. I live in a very old stucco home so the walls don't allow sound to pass through and I won't hear if someone is walking around downstairs

mike822

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2017, 03:55:59 PM »
Any response to my latest question

securitydude123

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2017, 11:01:03 AM »
I'm ok keeping cameras separate on an NVR. I have the honeywell L5210 - how can I get notifications on my phone and what module should I buy. Good idea on using internal zone for the basement motion detectors. How about the 1st floor where someone may come down at night for food/drink. Will putting glass break be sufficient or can intruders silently open my double hung windows and I won't even know someone is downstairs. I live in a very old stucco home so the walls don't allow sound to pass through and I won't hear if someone is walking around downstairs


I dont know much about honeywell but i believe you can only use Envisalink 4 but you needa vista panel.

depending on how many windows you have on the first floor and their location than glass breaks will be good, I still prefer motion sensors for full protection, double hung windows are not the securest of windows.
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mike822

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2017, 09:17:57 AM »
can thieves silently open a double hung window from the outside silently? If that's fairly easy to do, then how will glass break sensors help

securitydude123

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2017, 06:14:35 PM »
Hi Mike yes it is easy to get into a double hung window, I would either find a way to secure the window IE screw shut or use a stick. With a tool called a shove knife, an intruder can manipulate the latch of the window. So yes glass breaks would be useless, thats why i dont recommend glass breaks for most of my residential clients
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AlarmMike

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2017, 06:45:42 PM »
Keep in mind that burglars for the most part are not intricate.  They are creatures of simplicity and opportunity.  They do not wish to be caught prying or jimmying windows or doors.  They are more likely to kick in a door, or grab a large rock or cinder block laying around and smash out the window and reach in to unlock it.

Think of it this way.  This is how I spec out for a new client.

Your first line of defense is deterrence.  A burglar knows or believes you have security installed, then they will go to the next house that doesn't.  Translated, professional yard signs and door/window stickers.  Ones you buy online or at Radio Shack are obviously just for show.  Professional ones they will know that you most likely do have system(s) in place.

Next level is your perimeter.  Ideally, you want to stop them before they get into your house, not after.  That's where your door contacts, window contacts and glass break sensors come into play.  I also walk around the house from the outside looking to see what is truly accessible and items left outside that can be used to force entry.

Lastly are your interior zones.  We're talking about motion sensors and photoelectric beams here.  They should never be relied upon for primary detection.  They are your last line of defense in the event your perimeter is compromised.

If you have the Hope diamond under your pillow and a burglar knows it, then yes, a perimeter can be breached even silently.  I've seen it from my days as a police officer.  Burglar goes in via an outdoor crawl space opening, then from under the house, they either cut a hole in the floor, or gain access via an internal crawl space access.  Victims however were known gun collectors or high asset wealthy people.  Not your average Joe.  Yes, they could even use a glass cutter.  But figure 80-90% of burglaries are kick in the front door, or smash a window.

With a DH window, you can place a wireless transmitter on one sash and the magnet on the other.

You cannot screw a window shut.  Fire code and egress.
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securitydude123

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2017, 12:38:59 PM »
Good point on the fire code Mike, although depending on the floor it shouldn't matter for higher stories, but some excellent advice, in all my experience, most dirt bags are sloppy as mike states, if you want a simplistic system, make it simplistic. Chances are you will be protected with correct placements. In most B & E's I have seen almost all zones are set off and the burglars knock shit over and make a mess of the place. Like mike says, unless your sleeping on a million bucks and people know it, they are going after petty cash or easy pawn stuff.
"Don't be a prisoner of your own style"

mike822

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Re: Need advice - taking minimalist approach to security
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2017, 07:05:09 PM »
Got it guys and appreciate all the advice. Does a shock sensor double up the duty of a contact sensor? Or does a basic skill level thief trying to open the actual window from the outside going to set off the shock sensor? Still debating these two options
- Shock sensors on all windows
- Glass break sensors in the major areas where windows exist

Also found this combo contact + shock sensor 2-in-1 but can't find reviews - https://www.security.honeywell.com/hsc/products/intruder-detection-systems/wireless/glassbreak-detector-shock-sensor/1266264.html

Thx

 

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